Electoral fraud?



  • Hi!

    I am French Albion's creator here, and I wanted to let everyone know that I'm lumping my puppet nations (that I have inherited) of Spanish Albion, Yugoslavya, and Austrie-Hungarie under one large puppet: The United Kingdom. I'm going to keep those nations in the NS Forum, and use their data and create a nation that is an average of those populations and economies under a "British" crown. I just wanted to let you all know that, that anything pertaining to Spanish Albion, Yugoslavya, and Austrie-Hungarie from here on out belongs to the United Kingdom. I will take Spanish Albion's spot on the map as well (plot 12) and use that for French Albion, and use French Albion's plot for the United Kingdom. Is that okay with everyone?


  • Admin

    I'm not! You used Austrie-Hungarie as well as Yugoslavya to vote for you on the Commision elections! If those two puppets hadn't voted for you, you would have lost to GDR! GDR said not to use puppets or your will be disqualified and what did you do? You used two! You have breached the EU's laws!



  • I inherited these nations from people who couldn't be on NS anymore since we (my friends and I) moved to college, and they voted for me (French Albion) after I emailed them about the elections. If you want me to step down, I will step down, but that is the truth.



  • I mean, if you say that your friends gave them to you, then by all means, it shouldn't be an issue as long as they are the ones who voted before they gifted them to you.


  • Admin

    As it has been known, Austrie-Hungarie and Yugosalvya, who voted French Albion in the PC election, seem to be puppets. FA has said that he is indeed the owner of those nations as he inherited them from his friends. What are the thoughs and opinions of the members of the Council and what should we do?


  • Admin

    I suggest a Council vote of confidence.


  • Admin

    I am unsure whether FA was in charge of these puppets, or whether his friends were, or whether they were temporarily loaned back to them for the vote. I think a Council vote of confidence is appropriate. Calabria-Piemonte, by the looks of things, has no qualms at all, so I think we should gauge opinion.


  • Admin

    I'd support a vote of confidence.



  • Whether or not Calabria-Piemonte has no complaints is not the question as the nation is not yet officialy elected to the Courts and is not a member of the Commission. We need to decide how we will handle things like this in the future.

    Nazione Italiana would also support a vote of confidence.



  • However, it should be noted... unless I missed something... French Albion did not win the election on account of these two votes. In total, the nation received six votes and without the two illegal casts in question would have four. Nazione Italiana received three and the Reich received only two.


  • Admin

    Austrie-Hungarie and Yugoslavya have the same IP upon registration, the same as of The United Kingdom. This, indeed, is a case of puppets; I am temporarily suspending both of the first accounts until further notice as a result.


  • Admin

    **As an Administrator I can confirm that Austrie-Hungarie, Yugoslavya and The United Kingdom all share the same IP address upon registering. Furthermore, Austrie-Hungarie and The United Kingdom share the same e-mail address, though Yugoslavya does not.

    Due to the weight of the situation, I have suspended both the Austrie-Hungarie and Yugoslavya accounts until 2.45 pm on 7 June 2011, until further notice. The United Kingdom, as an account, remains unchanged.**

    That, and I don't like the idea of averaging nation stats. Pick one and use those stats; don't cherry-pick from both.



  • QUOTE (Inquista @ Jun 7 2010, 02:04 AM)

    If those two puppets hadn't voted for you, you would have lost to GDR!

    Actually, French Albion still would have won the elections, as the nation received four legal votes. Felice di Francesco received three legal votes while the Reich received only two legal votes.

    Ms. Vooleeck received more votes than di Francesco only in the poll, but only two votes for the Reich were actually posted.



  • 1. It's nice to know the moderating staff is so quick and on top of things! Wow, good info Soviet Union.

    2. No harm, again...as Nazione pointed out, still would have won.

    3. It's in the realm of possibility that they use the same computer if they're not wealthy college students.

    4. It's also in the realm of possibility that he's the one who registered them since they had less time then him, but he still wanted friends to be a part of this experience.

    Slim chances, yes, but I'm one of those jury members that needs to be proven beyond a doubt.



  • It seems we've had a few election problemsincluding non-registered votes ect. It would be worth putting the no puppet nations voting rule in the constitution as we're all agreed on it and having a revote. The same outcome is likely but at least we are doin things properly.



  • I don't support a revote honestly...because the wasn't influenced by the two additional votes, as Nazione Italiana pointed out. The fact remains that French Albion a) would have still won regardless in the election as NO ONE ELSE voted for a long long period of time and b ) we cannot determine when the transfer of the nations in question happened (whether it happened BEFORE or AFTER the vote).

    There is much too little in terms of logistical information that could validate or invalidate the electoral claim, and even so, doing simple math like we did to the non counted votes would still put French Albion as the winner.


  • Admin

    Maybe it didn't affect the overall result of the election, but let me ask a thing. If you are doing an exam and you get caught copying, you get a zero and the teacher takes your exam out. This is exactly the same, maybe he didn't copy at all the questions, but he will get a zero anyway.



  • See, again...this comes down to a logistical debate. Did he receive these nations before or after the election is the big question. If it's before the election, then yes, he should know better...foul play...he should step down as he has already offered.

    But if it came after the election, then there isn't a foul committed by anyone during the time of the election. French Albyon had already declared Spanish Albyon a puppet before the election in the NS message board, so clearly he does play by the rules. We can't damn someone's character if we don't know him personally.


  • Admin

    Calabria-Piemonte, you shall have the opportunity to oppose a revote in the vote of confidence. We cannot know whether French Albyon owned these puppets at the time or not, but when we consider that at best French Albyon called in a favour from his friends to vote for him, without the slightest intention of ever having any input into the EU (indeed I recall both nations being moved here recently), it does not look that great.

    I would support the following:

    -A vote of confidence in the results of the election (not the Commission itself).

    -If the vote supports the results, then we continue as normal.

    -If the vote is lost, then the Commission nominations, elections and debates shall be repeated. It shall be assumed that all nominees in the first vote shall be running again, unless they say otherwise.

    -A Constitutional amendment banning puppets and nations who have spent less than two weeks before the start of the elections in the EU from voting in Commission (and thus ECoJ) elections be tabled. I (or anyone else who wants to do this) shall table it regardless of the results of the vote of confidence.



  • If we revote and the same number of nations vote the same way, then we've done all this for nothing. That's what I feel would happen and as such, I don't support a ban either, because what if a nation JUST moves in and wants to get involved after reading through a debate? And with recruitment and all of these issues going on, that wouldn't be fair to the newer arrivals into the European Union.

    The fact remains that we simply don't know all the facts behind this, and even if he "called in", which I doubt because French Albyon could have done in earlier elections, looking at how long the puppets were active (thanks to population count on NS) in Duplessis Commission that it was a part of, so honestly...there should be know question of foul play or revote. Simple as that. It's just looking at what evidence we have as a democratic group and seeing that in democracies, they are innocent until proven otherwise, we should try and get all the facts before proceeding with ANYTHING. We're basing this off of muddy details!