Amendment to the Constitution for the Neutralization of the Council Speaker and Deputy Speaker
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"There’s a saying that goes: ‘If you want something done, ask a busy man by the name of Firoux to do it. Our Council Speaker is living proof that when it comes to getting the job done, he delivers."
"And yes, he is part of our party bloc and under his leadership; he us entitled to be part of, we all are equal; and we Progressives had passed the first major needed european legislation. As Progressives continue fighting to protect our rights, protect Europeans and hold this Council to account, Councillor Firoux is leading the charge."
"This proposal is useless, please dismiss or vote against it. We are more than personal feuds."
Emma Granger
Councillor for Montenbourg -
"Obviously I stand against this amendment.
I don't believe that politicalisation of the council is the correct work for this...poolarisation definitely is however. Cllr. Van Allen is once again taking upon himself to fight a problem he only believes in, much to the embarassment of his country.
Speaker Firoux has been nothing short of fantastic, fabulous, and most importantly fair in his role as Speaker. In his role as councillor of Inquistan he has been nothing short of fierce, fercious, and as is anyperson is faulty. Speaker Firoux separates his duties, and carries them out with perfect zeal to ensure that this Council is operating at the best it has been since the inception of the European Union. I believe the phrase is, 'Don't fix what is not broken' and I think it definitely applies in this case.
Do I think a discussion on the role of the Speaker within the European Council is warranted? Possibly it was before this proposal was introduced. Instead of testing the waters, and asking what the council truly felt was needed, Cllr. Van Allen dived head in with a lust for blood after being called out on his honestly annoying habit of withdrawing obviously failed acts. If you believe in something you should see it through to the end.
I thought this chamber was better than personal feuds, but the last few months have obviously proven not. This Union is starting to have more drama than The Apprentice. "
Carita Falk
Archrepublic of Vayinaod -
Colleagues, what is the problem with having a non-partisan speaker? I have included in my proposals that the Speaker can leave his/her political party if he/she is a member. So, in that way I believe that Coun. Firoux can still break up from his party in order to be a speaker. And then he can return as member if he decides to stop being Speaker. That way, we can ensure that the speakership of the Council is non-partisan.
Friedrich van Allen
Councilor, Kingdom of Reitzmag -
But why do we need the Speaker to be non-partisan?
Cllr Tupac Shakur
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First of all Coun. Shakur, a non-partisan speaker can ensure that there is no bias on the legislative rulings that he/she establishes. Such as for example the rules that Speaker Firoux had established yesterday. This is not some sort of ELDR/EPA conflict I want to open up. I have planned already to make this amendment since last month. It was just now that I had time to present more proposals. So, I hope you understand.
Friedrich van Allen
Councilor, Kingdom of Reitzmag -
Why does a Speaker need to be non-partisan in order to execute Speaker duties without political bias? As if a Councillor is magically without bias just because they don't belong to a Eurogroup? It's just a label, a label doesn't automatically override a Councillor's personality, goals, mission, etc. like some kind of robotic programming. Every previous Speaker has been partisan, yet the position continues to be reliably fair and apolitical.
A Councillor who also is Speaker wears two different hats, so to say. While wearing the "Councillor hat", they represent their nation, or at least...used to...and while wearing the "Speaker hat" they have an entirely different set of responsibilities. A good Speaker can seamlessly switch between their roles. They aren't acting as a member of said group while performing Speaker duties.
Requiring them to leave their Eurogroup, if any, accomplishes nothing except depriving their home nation of representation.We'll oppose the amendment.
Wesley Greene
Councillor of the Duxburian Union -
Coun. Greene, it wouldn't deprive their nation of representation if he/she leaves his/her eurogroup. The key word here is eurogroup, not nation. Therefore, nothing I see is bad for the speaker's country of origin in this amendment.
Friedrich van Allen
Councilor, Kingdom of Reitzmag -
Of course your amendment is explicitly to the detriment of Inquistans. As I laid out in my original statement, Inquistans not only expect to be represented by the councillor that they voted for on the ballot, which includes their eurogroup, but they expect their councillor to be able to advocate on their behalf fully without limitations. I was elected in part because I am a member of a certain eurogroup, and as such, some Inquistans have certain expectation that I support that eurgroup's agenda on behalf of Inquista. Furthermore, being part of a eurogroup has certain perks, which you cannot deny, because otherwise no one would be in a eurgroup if it didn't grant them certain benefits. At least, being part of the EPA certainly does have some benefits, besides our usual Wine Wednesdays. Inquistans both hope and expect that I have access to these benefits, because it ultimately allows me to succeed in the Council, which allows for Inquista to succeed within Europe.
I am the Councillor for Inquista, a position in which I have served for seven years, and have been elected to multiple times. I am also a bishop within the Inquistan College of Bishops, a member of the Secretariat, and the Chief Bishop Secretary of the Inquistan Orthodox Church. Please don't try and tell me or anyone what is best for Inquista, or what hurts Inquistans. I'm pretty sure I'm more of an authority on that.
You have consistently dodged and been unable to answer why the Speaker cannot be a member of a europarty. As it has now already been mentioned ad nauseam, the Speaker's duties are merely administrative. As stated in our Constitution: "The Speaker is a Councillor responsible for presiding over sessions of the European Council and moderating the legislative process. The Speaker is the official record-keeper of the European Council and is responsible for managing its statistical productions." This is a role that could be carried out by the most partisan and extreme of councillors.
Moreover, I feel that I have been a fair and neutral Speaker, and I don't partake in partisan conflict within the confines of the Council. You are the first and only councillor to ever make such a claim, and it seems apparent to me you've lodged it for purely personal reasons. I am a very lenient and laid-back Speaker, who has unfortunately been at the receiving end of your messy machinations, and I feel that you have taken full advantage of my Speakership, without any sort of partisan reprisals. As the Duxburian Councillor spoke just now, I remembered back to a time when Acwellan Devoy was the Speaker of the European Council. Speaker Devoy would have had a no-nonsense attitude to your sort of antics, and was far more strict with Council proceedings. I cannot imagine the amount of complaints and impeachments you would have lodged against him, and how you would have interpreted every slap of the wrist as some sort of personal and partisan attack on yourself. This annoys me greatly, because I am pretty proud of how I conduct myself as Speaker.
Gosh, even as my job as a councillor, and as a chairman of a eurogroup, I consistently work across the aisle and give everything a fair shake. I recently co-wrote legislation with an unaffiliated councillor, that being Councilor Evergreen of Malborya. I am also contributing to legislation which is currently being written that features a councillor from a different eurogoup, and I have voted for multiple Commission candidates who are not affiliated with the EPA. In fact, I am literally married to one of them. Most consequentially, I recently even sponsored an amendment put forth by a Nicoleizian communist which allows for eurogroups to exist with only two members instead of three. I fought tooth and nail in that debate for that amendment to pass, which essentially makes it much easier for other eurogroups to form and come together, and it's currently what is allowing the PEL to exist.
Anyway, I have nothing further to say to this current debate. I shall patiently wait to vote, and I shall vote against.
Edward Firoux
Council Speaker and Councillor for Inquista -
Mr. Speaker, I am sorry if this looked as if I am targeting you. But as I said, I had been planning to put this motion forward since last month. And now is my only time to put all motions I have planned into this Council.
I have always supported you Mr. Speaker. When you were recalled, I was one of those people who went to the streets and protest. I was one of those who tweeted and called for more people to join the protests. But then, your attitude towards me was very unappreciated. I had not been given the chance to stress out that I was democratically elected to my position as deputy councilor before I became councilor after Coun. Hufton's death. You have immediately deprived my nation of representation in the European Council and we had to conduct an elections very quickly. And it resulted in extension of sanctions from the Kingdom of Spain as they accused us of being undemocratic. You may have been fair as a speaker, but I have not seen any of your support towards me.
Friedrich van Allen
Councilor, Kingdom of Reitzmag -
Cllr. van Allen, let me see if I understood well. Is Cllr. Firoux fault that Spain has extended their sanctions? Do you really believe Spain looks at what Cllr. Firoux says about a country or a democratical process? The Spanish President, Jesús Aguilar, is old enough to have his own criteria, there's absolutely no need for him to call Cllr Firoux and say: "Hey Edward, should I saction Reitzmag? Were their elections undemocratic? Cause I'm not able to know if they were or not". That statement, with lots of respect, is completely stupid. You can't charge the Council Speaker with your own country mistakes or yours. Because that's quite disrespectful.
The Kingdom of Spain extended the sanctions because no one, absolutely no one, holds elections in just 4 days with no campaign, no debate. The Reitzmic Government choices and yours have not been the best for your foreign status. I would advice you to work on it, because if we go from mistake to mistake and meanwhile we make campaigns because "that position is not filled by an ELDR" and blablabla, it's not going to be better. Is going to be worse than it actually is.
Donald D. Tusk
Councillor for Spain -
Mr. Tusk, do you really support the idea of depriving my country of representation? And now this forces me to think that if we did not help elections in such duration, you would propose things that would be against the interests of my nation and then pass it without our opinions and votes. That wouldn't have happened it Coun. Firoux did not do that. He did not let me explain myself. So, which is not democratic there?
This is the main reason why I supported to keep the European Assembly and to Reform the European Council in a voluntary poll in one of our discussions. Because it would not deprive any nation with a representative in the European Union's legislative body.
Friedrich van Allen
Councilor, Kingdom of Reitzmag -
Oh wait, now going against Reitzmag and its Councillor is depriving your country of representation? C'mon Cllr. van Allen, you are much better than this. Elections need to have a debate, need to have a campaign. If you don't allow candidates to campaign and tell their ideas in public media, I can't guarantee that those elections were democratic. And again, this kind of victimhood because "oh you go against my country everyday", "EPA is really bad, they don't let Reitzmic Councillor explain himself" and "you would propose things that would be against the interests of my nation and then pass it without our opinions and votes"; believe me I've never seen as much crying as you have done in my whole political career.
And again, reforming the Council just because of your constant victimhood is an horrible idea, and in the discussion, we all have said the same. Abolish the European Assembly, Keep the European Council as it is.
Donald D. Tusk
Councillor for Spain -
Before we get too far down the garden path, it is best we steer this debate to the proposal of the Councillor from Reitzmag.
Mr Van Allen, I find it highly concerning that you did not even consider the possible ramifications and timing of such an amendment being proposed to this Council, and, as such, I am forced to conclude that your motives are somewhat ulterior.
I have served on this council for over four years through several Speakers, and, in that time, I have never felt as though the partisan interests of that Speaker or the nation they represent influenced their duties as Speaker. Speaker Firoux is no exception. He has served this Council with distinction, and his efforts deserve to be commended.
This Council is largely regulated by its members. The Speaker simply does not have enough power to necessitate the requirement that they be nonpartisan. Not only that, but in requiring the Speaker to remain non-partisan, you are hampering that Councillor's ability to represent their nation as they should. If this Amendment were to pass, we would very likely be hard-pressed to find viable candidates for the Speakership, as who would want to sacrifice their nation's voice on the Council simply for the sake of maintaining decorum on the Council floor?
It is possible, after all, to serve in multiple capacities and balance the interests and duties of each, especially when the duties of Speaker are largely constant and really do not conflict with those of the Councillor. In addition to that, we have a framework to lodge complaints against a Speaker and act accordingly, should the need arise. We have yet to see such a need.
You compare with the European Council to that of national legislative bodies. This comparison is a moot point that ignores the immense differences and implications of those differences between two such bodies. Not only that, but I'd go so far as to argue that essentially taking a duly elected representative and confiscating their ability to represent their constituents in the interest of finding an enforcer of sorts is undemocratic. The High Commissioner of the Fremetian Staatsrat, what you might call a Speaker, is appointed by the Staatsrat from a list of present and former judges that have served with the Ministry of Justice and cannot be a sitting member of the Staatsrat. I am not saying that every country should change their national policy, or that a policy change in the Council is necessary. I am saying that denying a constituency their vote in a representative body (regional or otherwise), is wholly undemocratic.
Don't even get me started on the term limits.
How can you talk about European integration and remain so combative with duly elected representatives of Europeans? This is a clear and premeditated move against your perceived political rivals.
I am strongly opposed to this Amendment.
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Dear Mr. Van Allen. Despite the fact that we are part of the ELDR together, I urge you to have some sense of reality. This amendment coincides with the many recoveries of amendments tabled which are already in the voting procedure. If it don't get your way, you withdraw.
When someone tells you the truth, you bite back hard, without any deliberate arguments or style. I am against this amendment to be clear.
Mrs. Azaya Dubecq
EU Councilor for the Republic of Nofoaga -
I must agree with Councilor Azaya Dubecq, Councilor Van Allen. I must urge you to keep your sense of sanity and reality.
Although, i understand the purpose of this amendment to avoid bias partisanship, I do not think that such an amendment is necessary. I think that many members of this Council would say that their nation's legislative branch that contains a speaker that is of a political group. There are many issues with this amendment that i feel that i must address.
First and this is something that i should mention as i believe other members in this body, including the Speaker himself, have mentioned. This amendment is something that I feel is just an attack against Speaker Firoux. I understand that you have, as the younger generations say, a beef with the Councilor from Inquista but this amendment is not the way to go at all.
Second, I do not know a legislative body on this plane of reality that places term limits on a position that a legislative body elects that ensures that it is sailing smoothly. I know some Territories and States in Leagio that place term limits on legislative members, but not on the title of Speaker; mainly because that they are already an elected official that might have term limits. None of the legislative branches that i witnessed or read about prevent an individual from being affiliated with a friendly political group.
I must at this point state that i am against the Amendment for i find it to be unnecessary, redundant, and aggressive towards one individual.
Francis Plessis
Eu Councilor for Leagio -
Councillor Helhuan stands up, and opens up a folder. She spends one split moment to peer over notes and then sighs
This might be an unpopular opinion in the Council, considering most of you are EPA members-- surprise, surprise, by the way, that this legislation is not well received. But anyways, I do actually think that Councillor Van Allen's Amendment does have some merit and touches on some problems that the EU Council is plagued by. That being said, there is one thing in this piece of legislation that I do not think is necessary. For example, this Amendment reduces a Speaker's term to 6 months. Why? I do not see the need to reducing the office's term if we are already weakening the position to begin with. And more importantly, isn't 18 months a short term to begin with? Council meetings do not need to be cluttered up by constant Speaker elections.
Similarly, term limits may sound like a good idea at first, but I ask the Councillor from Reitzmag what that will truly accomplish. Even if the current Speaker is removed, it is likely that an EPA candidate will take his place. And to the eye of an ELDR Councillor, I assume that this change will bear little distinction. No, term limits are simply not practical for this Council.
Next I would also like to address some of Councillor Firoux's points. The speaker claims that we are all equals in this Council, but is that really true Mr. Speaker? Because the Speaker has obligations and responsibilities that not every Councillor has. If I remember correctly, the Speaker has the power to remove people from the chamber. Now if I am having a bad day in the chamber, I will confess that I wish I had that power, but I don't. Because I am not the Speaker, but Mr. Firoux is. So no, we are not all equal. It is crucial that the Speaker act with impartiality and fairness. And if being in a Eurogroup gets in the way, I cannot help but say that Mr. Van Allen has a point.
Perhaps the strongest argument the Speaker brings forth is concerning the constituencies going unrepresented. Political Groups are not the sole factor in electing a Councillor-- we should keep this in mind. Correct me if I am wrong but as far as I can tell, the Speaker still can vote on behalf of its constituency. I am not in a Political Group, Mr. Speaker. And I am doing quite fine representing the Ruthenish people. The only agenda I see being hindered is the maintenance of EPA hegemony in the Council.
Overall however, I am in support of this Amendment. Should the 18 month term with no term limits be reinstated, you will have my full support.
Helhuan Zihuruthstukur
EU Councillor, Ruthund -
I am happy to see that someone in this chamber understands my point. And I am glad if the honorable gentleman from Ruthund will submit an amendment for this.
Friedrich van Allen
Councilor, Kingdom of Reitzmag -
Amendment I-- Authored by Cllr. Helhuan
Section IV. Speaker of the European Council
IV. The Speaker is elected for a period of eighteen months with unlimited terms
6 months with a limit of 3 terms. There is a seven day period for nominations and debate, followed by a seven day period for voting. Voting shall follow the Alternative Vote system. -
Debate has now closed. It is time to vote on amendments. Voting on amendments begins NOW and will last until 09:15 GMT on August 16th, 2020.
There is one amendment, proposed by Councillor Helhuan:
Amendment I
Section IV. Speaker of the European Council
IV. The Speaker is elected for a period of eighteen months with unlimited terms6 months with a limit of 3 terms. There is a seven day period for nominations and debate, followed by a seven day period for voting. Voting shall follow the Alternative Vote system.
I vote FOR the amendment.
Edward Firoux
Council Speaker and Councillor for Inquista -
I vote FOR the amendment.
Friedrich van Allen
Councilor, Kingdom of Reitzmag
The Kingdom of Spain
