Premier Commissioner Debate Aug/Sep 2020

Leagio · 28 Aug 2020, 03:24

"I too would like to Thank you, Ms. Devey, for hosting this debate.

"I would like to say that i think that Europe is a community that forever revolves around the idea of freedom, equality, and prosperity. Europe is filled with wonderful people that are filled with various ideologies. My goal is to provide the people of Europe a civic deal of political status quo, judical reform, and economic developement."

"My deal to the people of Europe is that i will not willingly change the political structure of the European Union. Europe is a system of where every nation is treated as an equal political entity and faces no bias. Every legitimate government is equal to every other legitimate government. If i am elected as Primer Commissioner, like the other candidates here, i will work day and night, even lose hair, to put the effort in bringing down the illegal and unelected government of the UNSR. I will work with the nations of Europe as an elected offical of an equal Europe to restore a democratic government to Icholasen."

"Many people say that Europe is downhill. Politicians always want to bring out a fake apocalypse whenever possible to get votes. I will not do that but instead, say that Europe is still strong and defiant to the ideals of democracy and equality; where we can have an Equal Europe For ALL! Thank you."

Fremet · 28 Aug 2020, 10:11

Thank you Ms DeVey and all those tuning in to this important event this evening.

We find ourselves in a crucial moment for the European Union. Change and instability have rattled the region over the last year, and in response we have seen calls for both immense change and regression.

We must not fall victim to the grandiose claims of what a highly integrated union can do, and we must remain wary of those that would wish to reverse the progress that we have made thus far. The European Union is a great institution, but as with all things, it has flaws. I stand for a better union. Some may call it incremental progress, but I call it feasible progress. We must create a Europe that does not serve the personal interests of politicians or memberstates. We must create a Europe free from corruption. We must create a Europe that will stand the test of time and not fall victim to the tumultuous winds of the national politic.

We have at our disposal a powerful vehicle to serve all Europeans, and it is our duty to do just that.

Thank you.

Icholasen · 28 Aug 2020, 15:31

Stephanie DeVey: Hello and welcome back to the Premier's debate. We have had the opening statements from our candidates, and it is now time to look at where they stand on the issues. Stephanie gets out her powerpoint clicker. Let's take a look at where our candidates stand on the issues that matter to you. (OOC: I didn't get Kerstin's responses, though RL problems of course got in the way. I can add her choices if you want @Leagio but if not don't worry !)

Merkel: Left/right: 4 EU: 6
Čikarová: Left/right: 2 EU: 3
Cocx: Left/right 5 EU: 3
Trympov: Left/right: 8 EU: 3
Kerstin: Left/right: 4 EU: 5

Stephanie: Candidates now have 2 minutes (OOC: 300 words) to give a speech about why their stance on the issues is the best. Candidates can also ask one other candidate a question about their answers to the questions, but candidates are not obligated to respond. If I believe that an important question was avoided by a candidate, however, I might pick them up on it in the next round where I will be asking individual questions. Candidates are free to debate freely, but not going over 1 minute (OOC: 150 words) per statement.

OOC: You have until 13:12 PM on the 29th of August to make your statement - you can reply to someone's question to your candidate after the time has elapsed as I imagine some will be asked in the middle of the night. If there are mistakes in the chart let me know.

Pravoslaviya · 28 Aug 2020, 19:12

Well, folks, would you look at that. The choice is so clear.

I am the only candidate who will stop the crazy spending projects, and return the money to the nations, and the people. All of the people, OK? Not just some people, like Kerstin, who wants to keep the budget the same, but cut contributions for poor countries, and she says the contributions won’t go up for the rich countries – I don’t know how that works, and believe me, I’m a businessman, if I could create money out of nothing, then I would, OK? But maybe she can explain that, I don’t know.

I am the only candidate who will end the under-representation of the larger countries, who put so much into our EU budget. The only candidate who will put citizens first. The only candidate who isn’t from the radical left who opposes the Refugee Protection Act – these people will bring that back, and that was the worst law of all time, and everybody knows it.

And you look at the other candidates, and it’s so bad. The EPA and the ELDR are the same party, they’re the globalist party, OK? The globalist party. They want to take away your borders – and so does Cocx, by the way. They want to force the nuclear countries to disarm. They even want to tell you what the definition of marriage is. They want all that run from Europolis, basically, they want to take away your countries.

You either have a country or you don’t have a country, and if the globalists try to take away our countries, then they’ll destroy Europe, OK? People will keep their countries. We need to totally defeat globalism to keep the EU together, and I’m the only person who can do that.

Leagio · 28 Aug 2020, 19:36

If the gentlemen from Pravoslaviya is really confused on how my plan works then let me put it in a way that, i think, he will understand within his own world. Think of Budget Cuts to smaller nations like a Tax Break, you know something that i would assume that businessmen like you receive from your government. The government gives back your tax money to help you invest more in your operations and boost the economy. That is how my plan works, the only difference is that the plan is for poor nations to help build up their development into having a better economic standing in Europe.

Inimicus · 28 Aug 2020, 19:59

"And here we go, ladies and gentlemen. Here we go. The infighting begins. On the one hand, a reactionary nationalist like Trympov is advocating a return to tribalism and 19th-century jingoism, and on the other hand, Senator Kirstin has absolutely no sense of concrete plans, no specific proposals. This is what I am tired of - and I'm sure you all are, too.

My answers to the pre-debate questions were based on facts, figures, and a healthy dose of common sense. One thing that does strike me, however, is Ms Čikarová's blatant and shameful refusal to support the Condemnation of the Coup in Icholasen. I ask - nay, demand - that she explain herself. A Cocx Premiership is tough on rogue states, and would never - ever - refuse to condemn an illegitimate government threatening to destabilise our region."

Czech Slavia · 28 Aug 2020, 21:35

"Because, Mr. Cocx, unlike you I truly support the right to self-determination. And I am also the only one here who supports this right. Even Mr. Trympov tells us that his EU would be violating national sovereignty just as much as the current EU. Revolutions that are not dependent on foreign help and succeed are legitimate and EU can't force its member states to a common diplomacy. Member states must act as sovereign, not as colonies of the EU.

And a candidate, that is known for getting so hurt by one fake edit of campaign poster being shared by his opponent that he couldn't stop talking about it during his campaign? It appears as if you think that you should be a Premier Commissioner because you were hurt, well I think Europe deserves better."

Czech Slavia · 28 Aug 2020, 21:38

"Now, I would like to explain some of my views in a bit more depth. I do think that EU should be a financial contributor to a infrastructure projects. If a country already has a factory, but lacks a proper road toward that factory, EU should subside new road, thus further developing said country, but only as a part of my economic plan. Same goes for the stimulus packages, the member states need to use the funds for developing their productive forces or essential services. But we must know what the money are used for. And developed countries should not be excluded from this plan.

I oppose banning of nuclear weapons and gay marriage guaranteed by the EU. But I am fully in support of denuclearization and gay marriage! EU however, has once no place telling its member states and their people, for example, who they can or can't marry. Not only is that an enormous breach of national sovereignty, but I also think it in turn may actually worsen some people's opinion on gay marriage, exactly because it is a violation of national sovereignty, and something that is seen as foreign.

I notice that Mrs. Merkel and Mrs. Kerstin support the Condemnation of the Coup in Icholasen, but also support banning of nuclear weapons. Well the current regime of Icholasen has nuclear weapons, so I'm left wondering what is the plan of Mrs. Merkel and Mrs. Kerstin. Do they want the recognized EU member states to denuclearize, while allowing the UNSR to keep their nuclear weapons and while worsening relations with them? Or are they ready to guarantee them safety to convince them to denuclearize? Or are they, perhaps, supportive of denuclearization only with their words, but not with their actions? I think the people deserve to know."

Icholasen · 28 Aug 2020, 22:01

Mr. Cocx has another 1 minute (150 words) to retort, and, if candidates feel they have been mentioned in this period of free debate they may have 1 extra minute to speak without my permission.

Pravoslaviya · 29 Aug 2020, 00:25

Kerstin, I don't need tax breaks, OK, because I actually have very good accountants.

And they’d tell you that your idea doesn’t work, and it certainly doesn’t work straight away. These things take time. They take time, and in that time, you have a big hole in your budget, which you’ll have to fill with more contributions from the big member states.

And also, Cikarova is so wrong. I am the national sovereignty candidate, and I am the candidate for consistency against coups. If a country has a coup, the EU can recognise that or not. That’s the EU’s decision, and I say not, because I want to end the violence. And by the way, I’m against the embargo, I don’t want embargos. But Cikarova says she’s against globalism, and then she doesn’t condemn the globalist coup in Inquista, where they literally tore Craticus apart – give me a break!

Czech Slavia · 29 Aug 2020, 01:15

"Mr. Trympov, I won't condemn the coup in Inquista precisely because I respect their national sovereignty. Nobody has the right to govern Inquista, but the Inquistans themselves! No foreigner should instruct them how to govern their country. I may disagree with their current government, but that is all, I won't intervene in their internal affairs.

I have no problem admitting that you are a consistent candidate when it comes to coups. Unlike some others, like Mrs. Merkel, who do not care for principles and oppose only those who they do not agree with. But you are very clearly not a national sovereignty candidate."

Fremet · 29 Aug 2020, 04:43

First, I will address comments made by Ms Čikarová regarding my simultaneous support of the Condemnation of the Coup in Icholasen and that of denuclearisation. I do not expect any EU memberstate to disarm if such a threat remains. I cannot, in good conscience, push forward such an agenda. If anything, the consequences of this rogue state controlling the arsenal of Icholasen and threatening other nations should be cause in itself to call for legislative action towards denuclearisation. All the major projects I propose I do not expect to complete in my 4 months. These projects cannot be done RIGHT in just four months. What I will do is get the ball rolling on long-needed reforms establishing a climate where nations have time to adapt to the new norm.

If we have any expectation of implementing long-lasting reform, we must take a slow and steady pace. For disarmament, we will slowly reduce the stockpile allowances phasing into an outright ban.

In lieu of a stimulus programme that would only serve to create added strain on the European Budget and massively increase the size of the European bureaucracy, I instead will introduce a special loan programme to be administered by the ECB that will offer low and no interest long-term loans to memberstates to facilitate long-term development and provide a stable access to credit to provide a buffer to national budgets in times of need.

As far as the European Space Agency is concerned, I will seek to freeze the ESA's budget at its current level until a formal review can be conducted into the actual needs of the agency. I am greatly concerned about apparent conflicts of interest regarding its current agency director and the risk of misappropriation of funds.

Yes, I do support a more cohesive immigration scheme for the EU, but I know that such a program cannot be rolled out overnight. I have said time and again that the European Union must be used as the vehicle that helps to facilitate deeper connections between memberstates. In time, those connections can be expanded to the larger union. Projects on such a grandiose scale must be meticulously planned to the letter or we risk losing and and all support for these efforts in the future.

Leagio · 29 Aug 2020, 06:58

"I will go into my stances. First, i would like to tackle on my stance on Gay marriage. One of the things that UDOHR does not cover a lot is the equal protection of people of different sexual orientations. In Leagio, I pushed in the recently adopted constitution for the equality of people of various sexual orientations and that includes gay marriage. Every human being has the right to be treated as a human and not an object of hate. I will push for the protection and legalization of gay marriage."

"Furthermore, focusing on the issue of Abortions and cannabis. I think that this is an issue that should be left to the people in the nations of Europe. The European Union cannot, in my opinion, take a stance on these issues because that is a way trample upon the sovereignty of the nations of this community in Europe. Especially the issues of cannabis, the issue of it falls under the commerce of the European Nations. overeignty shall not be an issue should be stripped by the EU Council."

"Now, i must agree with Miss. Merkel on her stance to Denuclearization. Nuclear weapons, whether they are in the UNSR, Icholsan, or any other nation, have, as a General in the Leagioan Army said, only one short-term goal of permanently destroying the land with radiation with no long-term goal when the fighting stops. However, the problem is seen that there thousands of nukes in the EU, and destroying them all properly in four or even eight months is like seeing Leagio First President come back from the dead. It cannot be done."

"The Nations of Europe have the right to work with other nations to build up infrastructure, but it should not be something that the EU should have to get involved with by using EU budget money. The budget for the ESA is at a high number that in my opinion should not be increased at all. The rest of the budget that the Director of the ESA wanted was too much as he failed to even convince the EU Council properly with a report on the necessity of such an increase; which would have hurt Europe economically as what if a global crash happens in Europe and many countries, as well as companies, need a bailout, then we would be in trouble."

Inimicus · 29 Aug 2020, 08:25

"It's immensely interesting to see that rather than engage with the content of my proposals and answer the question I put to her, Ms Čikarová instead resorts straight to the ad hominem. I also question her slightly awkward definition of self-determination. If self-determination means a small clique of communists taking over full, total control of a major EU nation, before banning all democratic process and shutting said country down from the world stage, then sure. She's right. But as far as I'm aware, self-determination involves democracy. Involves dialogue. Don't fall for it, people."

Czech Slavia · 29 Aug 2020, 09:00

"Mr. Cocx, I did answer your question. Your claims that I didn't do that are false. The current government of the UNSR did not shut the country down from the world stage, they were isolated by the EU. Self-determination means nothing less then the nation decides its own form of government. It doesn't require dialogue with foreing powers, Nicoleizians are equal with all the other nationalities. You are not their master, Mr. Cocx, to tell them how they should live their lives, they are perfectly capable to decide that themselves!"

Icholasen · 30 Aug 2020, 00:53

Stephanie in her mid-debate outfit change

Stephanie: Well that was entertaining! You have 2 minutes per question. (OOC: 300 words but you MUST separate these with 3 dashes.) You may continue to debate and call people out on erroneous claims with a 1 minute (OOC: 150 word) statement. May the debate continue as I live for this drama!

Merkel:

You support the EU banning nuclear weapons. Do you think that that is realistic? And do you think that the EU should pay for the cleanup?

You are the only premier candidate to have a different policy over the Coups in Inquista/Icholasen. You support the condemnation of the coup in Icholasen but not the Condemnation of the coup in Inquista. How is this coherent?

Kerstin:

You have said the EU budget should not rise. If this is so, how do you propose to pay for stimulus packages to poorer EU nations?

There are a few areas where you disagree with your ELDR Colleague Jasper Winston. For example, he supports increasing the ESA budget, the Anti-Space Weaponry Act, and he wants a unified standard curriculum for European schools and you oppose all of these. Is he wrong? And if he is wrong, why do you endorse him?

Cikarova:

You do not think gay marriage should be guaranteed by the EU, you oppose making immigration easier and expansion of the UDoHR, how exactly are you different from the so-called reactionary Trympov?

You are the only candidate here to not support either coup condemnations (Icholasen and Inquista). If there was a coup in Czech Slavia, would you or would you not want similar legislation condemning the insurgents in your country?

Cocx:

You support a Green New Deal, which you describe as ‘where nations come together to strengthen their environmental standards’. Do you think this project would also need money and investment? Or can it function just through, seemingly, voluntary changes?

Wouldn’t a large EU rail project help your green new deal?

Trympov:

You propose decreasing the EU budget and ‘returning the money to the nations’. What would you say to someone whose job is tied to EU funding and is worried about their livelihood being lost?

You think pro LGBTQ legislation has gone too far. But do you think LGBTQ rights need to be scaled back?

You have until 14:00 PM BST on the 30th of August.

Inimicus · 29 Aug 2020, 15:28

"Just to return to the point Ms Cikarova made: Yes! Self-determination means that nations determine their own faith. Nations, Ms Cikarova. Not small political cliques. Nations determine by democracy their government, not by coup or armed force. And while tanks roamed the streets of Icholasen's ancient and beautiful cities, you sat there and supported it all. Shame on your for supporting this kind of regime, for shame."

"Thank you for your question, Stephanie. A Green New Deal is indeed one of the cornerstones of any Cocx Premiership. We want a world where every European can live in safety, security, and in a clean environment. Too often governments and administrations consider the environment second, and politics first. This must change. However I am also clear about how this must change, and this is where I differ from many other pro-Green Deal candidates for Premier and Internal. A Green New Deal can only succeed when governments themselves make this deal. We cannot, must not, force a Green New Deal on nations, and therefore it is important that such an agreement is a deal between governments, on a multilateral basis. The Premier Commisssioner is not a dictator, or someone who orders governments to do his or her bidding. As Premier, I will aim to organise a multilateral Green Deal Conference, where the foundations for this agreement can - and will - be made."

"I'm not opposed to high-speed rail, far from it. During my time as Duke of my Inimician Terra, I sponsored the current internal Inimician high-speed rail network and worked with three other Ducal administrations - multilaterally, mind you - to pool our resources and get these railways going. This is, as you quite rightly say, Stephanie, something that could definitely help a Green New Deal take shape and reach its aims. My opposition to Commissioner Juncker's proposed Eurostar project was simple: he threatened to take billions upon billions of Euros from member states' contributions to arrange this project from scratch. My version of Eurostar, as part of this Green New Deal, would be the multilateral pooling of funds, as I arranged in Inimicus, improving and building on already present cross-border infrastructure where possible. And where it isn't, or is too old, yes, we will build new railways. But not as a part of the contributions of member states. That would contradict the Cocx Principle of Putting Member States First."

Czech Slavia · 29 Aug 2020, 17:27

"I'm sorry Mrs. DeVey, but I must answer to Cocx demagoguery. The people of Icholasen don't seem to support the old regime and are not in opposition to the new government. The revolution in Icholasen was not supported from a foreign powers and succeed, meanwhile the pre-revolutionary government is completely dependent on foreign support and can hardly be called Nicolezian anymore. You have no place deciding for Nicoleizians with regime they support, you have no evidence stating they would support the return of the old regime. Let the Nicoleizians decide, no regime can survive without the support of its populace, unless it is kept in power by foreigners. Everything I said so far can also applies to the coup in Inquista. And true adherents of the right to self-determination must oppose any attempts to make Nicoleizians and Inquistans the slaves of few European bureaucrats."

"Thank you for the very good and important questions Mrs. DeVey. Regarding the first question, me and my opponent Trympov are very different candidates. We both of course both stand for the rights of countries to defend their borders, have their own marriage laws and so on and so on. But once you look past these patriotic policies, you will see that there is very little left of Trympov policies. Yes there is the Council Seats reform, which will needlessly take the money out of the EU Budget and in turn we will get a system where countries are not equal. I am of course opposed to this reform.

My plan on spending money from the EU budget on the other hand go into productive projects, aiming at developing the member states, resulting in an increasement of quality of life all over Europe. Improving the lives of common Europeans is my goal, improving the lives of the elites is the goal of Trympov. But my policies go even beyond that, ensuring and expanding the right of workers across Europe, which is something Mr. Trympov opposes. Trympov has nothing to offer besides the opposition to the globalists, I do."

"If there hypothetically was a coup in my country I would of course stay true to my principles. If such a coup is dependent on foreign support, then such a coup would of course deserve a condemnation and it does not matter if such a coup would take a place in Czech Slavia or any other country. No country should however be forced to such a condemnation, but I would certainly condemn any such coup.

If the coup is however not dependent on foreign support, that means that such a coup has at least certain support among the populace. I would fight against those who would attempt such a coup, but I would never sell my country and the people living there to the foreigners in exchange for their support! I will always be on the side of our people and fight for their independence from all foreign powers."

Pravoslaviya · 29 Aug 2020, 23:55

I say return the money to the nations, and to the people. That bit’s very important, OK, because when you return the money to the nations, you also return it to the people.

But I do not want to go round saying ‘you’re fired, you’re fired’, OK? Except, maybe, Juncker. I’ll make an exception there. But I would try and make savings without cutting jobs where possible – I’m a businessman, I can do that – and if we have to cut jobs based on EU funding, I would say we’ll actually create more jobs all over Europe by giving the money back to the nations, giving it back to the people, so they can spend it how they know best. Over time – and that’s the bit Kerstin misses, by the way, over time – that lifts up the economy, and there’s more jobs for everyone.

But folks, it’s time we focussed less on the jobs of EU bureaucrats, and more on the jobs that have been lost, all over Europe, due to globalism, over so many years. The forgotten people of Europe, the ordinary citizens, have been getting screwed so badly for so long, and it’s really sad. And that’s the fault of the EPA globalists, and the ELDR globalists just want to speed that up even more.

We return the money to the people, put citizens first, and Make Europe Great Again; and then we’ll have so many jobs, not just for the bureaucrats, but also for the millions of ordinary people who’ve lost their jobs to globalism. I will be the single greatest Premier Commissioner in the history of this region, for jobs, and for a lot of other things, also.

Look, I love the gays, and actually, they happen to love me too. So much. There are so many gay people, bisexual, whatever, who are supporting me, and that’s wonderful.

I do not believe that Europolis should be telling member states what is and is not marriage, OK? And I also do not believe that Europolis should be telling gay people, trans people, and so on – consenting adults, of sound mind – that they can’t go for a conversion therapy, if that’s what they want. If someone freely goes for some crazy treatment that, I’m told, doesn’t work, then, within reason, I think that’s their business. Maybe it’s their country’s business, but it’s not the EU’s business, in my opinion. That’s all, OK? I certainly do not want anti-LGBTQ laws in the Council, that's for sure.

Where I think we can do better is protecting our LGBTQ communities from hateful ideologies that come from outside our region. The globalists passed a law, and you all saw they want to bring it back, that basically destroyed our borders and told us to accept so-called ‘refugees’ from outside this region. And they want to extend the UDoHR to people who aren’t EU citizens too. Even if they hate gay people and want them to die. How crazy is that, folks? Can you believe that?

The globalists all wrap themselves up in the rainbow flag and they say ‘oh, we support the gays, we’re pro-gay’, and they say ‘oh, bad member states’, but they throw the door open to people who, some of them, we don’t know, might want to kill the gays. And folks, you’re not allowed to even ask.

Cikarova is wrong again. She’s not having a good night, but that’s OK. We are both against globalism, yes, and I agree we are different candidates – with her, you get radical leftism, she’s pro-coup, and everybody knows that, and also, she wants to take your money, and spend it on crazy projects.

But with me, we’re going to have laws to stop unfair trade policies, like huge subsidies for big corporations, so we stop globalism ruining ordinary people and small businesses. We’re going to stop the flow of money behind coups, so we have law and order, and prosperity, in the region.

Folks, the globalists want to take your money and give it to big multinational companies. The radical left, and maybe the ELDR too, want keep your money for themselves. I alone will return the money to you, and stand with you against both big business and big government.

Leagio · 30 Aug 2020, 04:31

"Thank you for your questions, Stephanie. In my plan to keep to the budget of the European Union, where i would provide a stimulus to the poorer EU nations the answer is really not that difficult to provide. In the recently passed bdget for the 2020-2021 fiscal year, the treasury within the EU is exactly €41,533,986,797.15. The total revenue made was €73,267,821,908.85 with only about 31 Trillion Euro's being used. That is enough money for emergency spending for the EU in a scenario that requires immediate spending like a pandemic for example or an EU-wide economic crash. That amount of surplus is that the budget provides is enough to where we could use about 35% of it in a stimulus to the poorer nations of this community. In addition, it is enough to where we can make cuts to the budget to where we can have the poorer nations not pay this year's contribution and use to build up their own economic development, which in theory would bring a higher contribution from them in the next years budget. "

"On your second question, i will provide a short answer with a long explanation. I do not think that Winston is wrong but there are some things that I disagree with him about. In Leagio, being in a Party does not automatically mean that you stay loyal to the party because in Leagio being a politician means that you put the country above party. At times, you have to vote for something that will help your constituents even if it benefits them and is against your beliefs. And there have been times that i disagreed with even the President of the Commonwealth (which we both are of the Civil Populist Party) and think that what he does is not enough or wrong. The status of me being in ELDR is only a symbol because if I am elected as Premier Commissioner, in this race for PC, I place the well-being of the EU over Eurogroup. Something that I believe think that many of the candidates understand as one of the things that the Premier Commissioner must do, as stated by the Constitution of the EU, is sign legislation without the power to veto, even legislation that they will hate or disagree with because it will be legislation made and represented by the needs of the people of the European Union."